An Open Discussion – Static Versus Bagged : Where’s Your Allegiance?

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-April 11, 2013-

An Open Discussion – Static Versus Bagged : Where’s Your Allegiance?

Andrew Ritter

It's an argument that finds its way into discussions in every car show parking lot and enthusiast garage. Spanner wrenches and elbow grease are pitted against control switches and compressors. The debate gets heated as claims that your car isn't low enough until your subframe hits asphalt are met with remarks that "airride is cheating". Some guys will never give up the springs that rest on the perches of their coilovers, while others have swapped them out with their rubber counterparts to abolish that last quarter inch of gap in their wheel well. In this low lifestyle, enthusiasts often pledge their allegiance to a side. Which side are you on and what you draws you there?  We sit here in the StanceWorks office and we've decided to kick off the discussion ourselves...

Mike Burroughs: I've built cars with air suspension and I've built cars with "static" suspension, and I think they've both got their place - points like cost, style, capability, performance, and practicality are all valid. However, I think one stands above the rest: ask any hardcore static guy and he's going to tell you one thing - bags are the easy way out, and I think it's a hard one to argue. There's something inherently more impressive when two cars sit side-by-side, both with mind-blowing wheel and tire fitment, and you discover that one is on air and the other is static. Simply put, when it comes to a static car, what you see is what you get.  While both cars may look phenomenal, the air-ride owner simply pressed a button to achieve his look while the coilover owner is committed to his look. There's no "drive height" and "show height," they are one in the same.

Andrew Ritter: While both are impressive, airride allows you to squeeze out that last bit of height that would otherwise leave your car un-drivable. It allows fenders to be tucked in between lip and stretched tire. Bumpers can come in contact with the ground. With the press of a switch owners can tuck those large wheels up against the wells while laying their subframe on the ground. The "drive height" and "show height" you mention allow the car to have an insane fitment and then be driven rather than simply parked at a show. With static cars you wear away subframe bolts on a daily basis and that tight fitment leads to burnt fenders.  Every speedbump and steep parking lot entrance slows static cars to a crawl as they scrape their way over, leaving bits and pieces of their undercarriage behind.

MB: While some guys take pride in the damage their cars receive, I think most people can respect a smashed oil pan as a certain "badge of honor," whether its in jest or seriousness. While it's silly, there's an obvious level of commitment that comes with "living the low life." Smashed oil pans, worn frame rails, burnt paint, et cetera. To some, they're earned. Not to mention that if needed, coilovers can, with relative ease, be cranked up to realistic heights suited for harsh roads. Or better yet, the track. In many ways, it's the best of both worlds. A large portion of the car scene prefers a balance between aesthetics and performance, and I think most would agree that coilovers offer the better balance. Dedicated track cars use coilovers for a reason, and you have that capability with the turn of a spanner wrench. Sounds like the better end of the deal, no?

AR: While nearly all track cars enlist coilovers for their competition needs, airride has improved a great deal over the years and it offers the performance that most enthusiasts need. Competition race cars need the finite adjustments of a coilover to dial in turn-in, corner balance the car, and address and handling needs. For 99% of car enthusiasts who are simply looking to enjoy their car on twisty roads and back mountain streets, this is overkill. With a quality airride setup, you can still have a car with fun sporty handling.

MB:  To be fair, even if airride offers good enough handling, it sure seems like an expensive way to more or less "compromise." Air ride systems can get into the thousands of dollars when it comes to struts, lines, management, and the like. While coilovers can exceed $10,000 for a set, it's not hard to find a solution for less than a tenth of that, which in turn will get you down the road, having fun, and looking good.

AR: Airride can be expensive, but it's a modification that will let you truly enjoy your car. We all know someone who is unable carry multiple people in their car without rubbing, or have seen someone who rubs down their tire sidewalls with every turn taken at speed. Those are true sacrifices, as you trade off many of your car's functions for a low static height. Soon you are left with a car that can only be used with gentle care. The comfort, adjustability, and the care-free nature that an air suspension allows you to have that insanely low car while still having a car that you can use day to day without any stress.

The arguments for each side are endless, and we're sure there's much more to be said. From performance to practicality, each point is valid. With the introduction of threaded air struts for newfound adjustability, will air continue to grow in popularity with the previously "static only" crowd? Or will the proven method of coilovers make a comeback? We're eager to hear your opinions - which side are you on? What suspension is under your car, and what's your reasoning?

 Use the comment section below to share your opinion.

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71 comments
jaytoolman92
jaytoolman92

I think when deciding on your suspension set up it's necessary to realize that neither one is going to allow you to keep your fenders stock. Everyone has to roll them and sometimes even cut some pieces out. I would prefer air bags for the ease of day to day use but the budget might not allow them. http://www.perfectionpaint.ca/services.html

am2can
am2can

easy fix for a lower. stiffer ride that allows rear passengers with no sagging rear suspension issues: Use Bilstein sport shocks, remove the Nader-mandated spacers, find decent sway bars (3/4 of an inch, I have 1 inch, kind of rare) and you have the best handling 02 that goes over speed bumps and wails flatly around corners!

Richard
Richard

From the old way to the new way, Now the new trend is putting the UAS Aerosport bag on the coil overs like BC, Megan, Stance, D2, and many more, with the adjustable dampening and the adjustable body you can achieve the best of both worlds, great road handling, desired stance, and still lay it out for show. there are cars using these bags on track and daily use all saying they love the new way and how they handle. the aluminum brackets are already threaded for a direct fit to the coil overs that they have applications for. definitely something that has entered the market for the coil over guys.  

HussainMumeni
HussainMumeni

air ride suspension has come along way since the 90's. I've done my re-search. air lift has a video of a couple cars tracking and comparing them to coilovers. Seemed like the air ride got better lap times. it's not just you show car anymore. The rubber used now is much stronger and handling is so much better. With quality bag bag struts, you will get a ride quality similar to coilovers. I wouldn't mind going either route. But for daily and reliability, and the occasional track day i'll prob be going with a bag set up.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uppK8z0lDg

Hevymet
Hevymet

it doesn't matter if you're on coils or air....lowered is lowered. (Dom's tone talking to Brian in F&F. "winning is winning" line)

Stephen Brewer
Stephen Brewer

I have built plenty of vehicles. Everything from 768 AWHP evo. To the oldschool 1985 Chevy c10 laying on the ground in 22s. In all my experience, I have learned the decision of air or static really lies in "what do you want your car to do?" If you want a tight suspension, and only a slight drop but want great feedback and adjustability every now and then, GET COILIVERS. They can ride great if you buy reputable ones. If you want your car to sit on the ground and ruck rim, and still be driveable just as soon as you start it up, GO PHEUMATIC. Air is very fun and a cool thing to have. My 2001 Lexus GS 430 is almost tucking rim all around on a 19x10.5 up front and 19x11.5 in the rear, and I am on Megan coilovers with custom spring rates. I am about to ditch those and get more drive ability out of my car by going air ride. I hope this helps someone. What do you want?

Han
Han

Static... the art of driving.

KyleCrisham
KyleCrisham

I honestly could care less if a car is on air or coils, it doesn't matter to me, its how you pull off either with the look you are going for. My only gripe with air in these last few years is at shows. It seems like it's impossible for someone without air ride to win a show. And I'm not speaking of myself, my car is not a show car by any means. But I have seen cars with hundreds of hours of work into them; in their bay, rewiring, custom body work, rare euro parts, functional/ professionally balanced suspension and maxed out N/A motors or freshly turbo'd monsters that have lost to a car with bags, $3k wheels, and option lips/side skirts. THAT is the problem with air, in my opinion.People hold these $2k-$3k bolt on kits in such high regard that they win over someones blood, sweat, and tears.

 

I drive my car daily on ISC coilovers maxed out with my damping set to a mid-level stiff setting. And I live in NH. Bad roads are not an excuse for not lowering a car or going with air instead. I have broken one pan in the last 5 years, and it was because my FKs were blown. Yes, my rear fenders are burnt due to 10" wide wheels poking a bit. And yes, I do cringe every once and a while as I lift my butt off of my seat in preparation for an oncoming hump or pothole. But I know that my car can out-handle any of my friends cars that are on air ride, I know that I get just as much looks rolling down the street as those friends, and I know that I will never pop a bag when I'm 500+ miles away from home. If I blow a strut, who cares? I can still drive on it and fix it later. I personally would never buy an air ride setup unless my only goal with that car was to lay my subframe on the ground. But for any car enthusiast, if that's your main goal with your car, you're in it for the wrong reasons. As my father and many other car guys say, "a car is meant to be driven" and for real car enthusiasts, driven hard.

NGiles
NGiles

I can appreciate any car for whatever it is as long as it is built nicely and with quality parts; bags or coils, if its nice, I like it. I have always considered bags "cheater buttons" and will continue to rock coilovers for as long as i own my mkiv. Driving around static low takes much more on-road attention and driver ability than pressing a button when you see a bump or pothole. 

AKdub914
AKdub914

I ran coils for about a year or so living here in the NYC/ Tri state area. But driving static low on HR ultralow coils through urban city areas that often have unforgiving roads and construction, can be destructive to your cars under side so i had to go air. After taking my coils off and inspecting my car... being so low with a stiff suspension i ended up actually bending bolts and damaging important parts of my car. the switch to air has been the best choice so far and believe it or not the car performs and handles just the same. I say air for function and security when parking your car, coils for the track and racing.... if you have a racekor

DarrenNt
DarrenNt

I've had my car on both coilovers and air and tbh for me air wins hands down. I have several large speed bumps in my road and on coils I couldn't get anywhere near the height I wanted to be at. With the air I hit the switches and just glide over them, easy. Once onto the main road I can lower it right down to where I want it and drive. I can't imagine how much money I've saved by installing the air and the time gained through not being in the garage replacing sumps. It's a laugh when you do the first one but after a few it soon becomes tiresome to be dragging it back to the garage again. Then again anyone who thinks air is like a magic wand to ultimate lows is sadly mistaken as well. Most cars take a lot of modification to get anywhere near putting subframe down. I know personally I've had to have a lot of custom parts made to sort out the stance properly. But as the saying goes each to their own. I don't predujice against either because if the end result looks good who cares what's underneath.

LukeMartinez
LukeMartinez

I have a '90 Civic Wagovan on coilovers. Can't wait to get air ride!

PR0PH37
PR0PH37

I bet the more hardcore old school enthusiasts had this same dilemma except it was: Cut or coil? The cuts would say the coils cheated and blah, blah, blah. You can ride on static heights on a bagged set up and then park even lower. If you can afford it, bagged is the only way to go and the future. BTW, people still cut the springs and think its cool. Lol

Caseyculby
Caseyculby

Air rides are more for show cars, it's not as much of the "Low lifestyle" but they rep it at shows cause they like the look.  It not as committing as a "static" driver. Right now I'm on KyB struts and cut/lowering spring on my s13.  Yes it rides a bit rough in some occasions but do I love the way it looks and handles?  Hell Yes.

Alex182
Alex182

I bear no ill towards bags. Living in a city with notoriously bad roads, I myself have looked towards them with serious consideration. I just don't think it's cool to need a couple planks of wood, a few mates, and a whole hour to get out of the driveway.

AndreasKuehn
AndreasKuehn

Here in Germany we have people like AH Suspension, who built insane Coilover Setups based on H&R Clubsport Coilovers and Racing springs, with which you can get insane low, without rubbing tire or something. Ride Comfort ist really OK (and not tooo Hard) and Track Performance is also way better than in most Coilovers which came from factory. With coilovers you can get really low setups which are daily driveable with good performance. You only have to know how and where you can get the parts, the companys that can offer you ultimate static solutions. The time of "limits" of static suspensions is over. And for me, i am from germany, and for me the challenge is not only to get low, but too get low "street legal", with permission of the german TÜV. And this is much more difficult than simply slam your car!

JackKeller
JackKeller

Throughout my life I've built a great deal of custom cars, my early days were about lowriders, not just sitting low but hopping and dancing, then i went the boosted static "racecar" route for a while, now I drive a bagged car and I'm completely happy. That said, I give props to the static guys for the dedication however I have things to do and no time to remove my bumper to get in and out of my driveway, while you're limping to a meet or show I been enjoying that scenery for some time.

volvosome
volvosome

Who cares what anyone says. It's your car so build it how you want it. If you want bags, use bags. If you want coils, use coils. Screw what the community says. What we're all doing is ridiculous when you boil it down regardless if its on air or coils. 

JakWhite
JakWhite

My car is low on its hydro's and I get annoyed when I hear a bang or scrape on the road as it means potential cost. But my engines in the rear so its slightly higher and hasn't gotten damaged so far so I feel I 'can' run static and the only thing that gets damaged is the bar that runs across the belly pan and two loops on the front subframe, All my bolts are fine, however I'm awaiting for one or all of the bolts on the subframe to sheer due to a rather large pothole one day. Personally I prefer coils as you can always put them up a few rings so the cars more driveable/trackable depending on how much you spent on them. But if my car was for shows I'd have air, its something cool to play with and looks good when installed right. But like I said, my cars on hydro's so I can't have either. I just pump it up or let gas out depending on what I feel like and adjust the stiffness of the damper to accomodate. (Good ol MGF) 

braaap76
braaap76

low=lifestyle. lifestyle=commitment. commitment=static. Therefore low=static

TimBaker
TimBaker

each have a place, but i'm so for static I crackle with it

George C
George C

If the boot is too small then static. Else bagged :)

TaylorMenezes
TaylorMenezes

People are failing to realize that you can do burnouts on bags AND coils. Mindblown.

BavarianStance
BavarianStance

I tend to drive my cars pretty hard. I always find my self pushing it just a little more. My current car is a 1986 325es slow yet, a fun car. It's very rigid and stiff. Very opposite of the newer plastic feel cars. I spend most of my time driving it. It's barely ever parked! I love the challenges that come with a static low car. I don't go to many "scene events" just a few local meet ups. I am not into the whole parked car thing. I love to find a fine point between function and low! When this is achieved one has a good feeling about self and car. The looks on faces of everyday people is priceless when I drive by. For me a car must remain low while driving or parked!

 

 

 

Flaktwo
Flaktwo

I have done the static/coils and recently did air ride. My personal view is don't knock it till you have tried them both, I had the some concerns about air ride when i ordered it but it has surprised me time and time again. They have come a long way and the same cost as a decent set of coils. While the install took 50+ hours and something I did myself to cut cost, it has been worth it. I have to agree driving in a static car has is thrills and badges of honor/damage in a way, it becomes stressful as a daily driver to deal with a busted oil pan and pump, wear on the tires from rubbing etc...Air ride for me gives back that pleasure of jumping in a car and driving it without a worry and reducing costs associated with being static. Plus it's kind of hard to drive a lowered car when we get tons of snow. I'm going to finish by saying that if i had a weekend car/track car there would be coils in it but for my dailies i will always resort to Air Ride.

KhalilKassem
KhalilKassem

Being on coils for me atleast is somewhat of a thrill from time to time. The funny moments where you are in unfamiliar grounds and somewhat on the edge of your seat staring down at the road infront, aimlessly searching for the smallest imperfection in the road as to be able to calculate your next move so you do not damage anything haha. 

 

It takes more effort and commitment to drive low on coilovers, not saying that it's less effort on bags because you can drive pretty low on bags too if you're setup for it, but it's easier for bagged cars since they can always air up when they are about to encounter some sort of trouble as for the static guys they have to bite their lip and deal with it. Coils also have a more connected feel to them, hard to explain but I'm sure most people get what I mean. It's a lot more work to setup your car how you want it on coils and in the end it's alot more satisfying then just adding or dumping air by way of button. 

 

I can appreciate airride as I did have a bagged car myself, it's definitely alot of fun playing with switches and what not haha. But for me static is the way to go.

lastexile
lastexile

I completely agree with Justin Jadunath, being a family man with a wife and 2 kids bags is really the best (and really only) option for me. My car is currently static and not as low as I would like and I want to go lower but I can't see myself going out and adjusting the coils every time I pack in the whole family, on top of the fact that my car is my dd. I need that adjustability that bags offer. Don't get me wrong I love static and respect the people who choose that route but I think there is no clear winner here. Jaze & Dave Schonrock both pose good arguments but so does theneek and Jeremy Whittle. I think it all depends on your situation and what your are going for.

SamMauri
SamMauri

I have to say that both forms of suspension setups deserve a lot of respect. If you really think about it, they're probably just as expensive (up front cost of airride vs more repair work to your bumpers and fenders in the long run) but I don't know if that really matters. What matters is, as many here have said, the goal of the driver. For me, I would love an insanely low car with some good HP to rip on the track. With that car, I would have to go static. But my car, a 1976 BMW 2002, has less than 100 horsepower and with that, I really don't need insane handling. I just need a comfortable setup that would still look good and that I would be able to customize depending on how many people were in the car so my nearly-40-year-old frame doesn't end up torn up on a speed bump. That's why I'm saving up for an airride setup.... Plus I've already had to deal with the "no one is allowed in the back seats or my tires will rub" situation for two years and it's honestly kind of annoying! 

ChristianVrancken
ChristianVrancken

there's no need for discussion it's just depends on what the owner wants if he wants to be a static and stay true to his stanced look or he's is seeking practicality to cross a speed bump more easily it's up to the owner of the car nothing more nothing less just his vision of how his car should be

plokijuhyg1
plokijuhyg1

I love em both. Both have their advantages and disadvantages just like comparing the actual cars that is running each setup. It all comes down to what you as an owner wants out of it, simple as that. 

heavystarch
heavystarch

Both bags and coils can give any car a proper stance...bags perhaps a bit more proper when parked.  ;^) I just think it really depends on the goal of the owner of the car.  Do they want to have the ultimate stance for their car?  Is it all about looks?  Go bags. Or does the owner think about tracking their car and going around twisty mountain roads?  Then go coils.  

JustinJadunath
JustinJadunath

Understand that I do not own a car yet. But if I did...For me, and for me only (it is MY opinion) I'd go with bags. Being a family guy, I have a daughter and a Girlfriend that I would love to take out on drives all over the place. To Whistler, to Victoria, the Interior of BC and more. I also ride bikes and love to get outside. Bags would be my option primarily because I can raise the ride height when carrying folsk and stuff, but if I'm out on my own and just crusing then I an drop her down and show off the cars lines, wheels and more. I realize that there are two schools of thought on this, and that there are many opinions and idea as to what's better. But as it's been said many times it is up to the individual to go for what makes them feel good. I firmly believe in this and I'll never berate soemone who thinks that static is the way to go. If the shoe fits...

ollie
ollie

For me it's partially a sense of pride since I've been dailying static cars throughout NY year-round for quite a few years now. I can truly understand and connect with the dedication that others share with me.  It's also partially because of that magic something that a static car posseses. To me cars just look and feel better to me "driveable." Of course this isn't your typical definition of driveable. A car resting the fender inbetween the lip and tire can look good but I know it's not being honest with me even though it's very driveable with a flip of a switch. If a car with just mm's of clearance rolls away like that and hops on the highway, though, it has an indescribable presence and integrity to it. With everything else held constant, a static car will always beat a bagged car in my book. Even if it's a bit rougher around the bumpers and fenders, I would still prefer it because it earned the title.  If you can relate to that feeling, then you're probably a static guy. Plus no air set up can do what a static car can in regards to unreal ride heights and wheel fitments. People are always associating air with vip. Most of these vip builds we see across seas wouldn't be possible on air. Aircups, however, are a great alternative for some practicality while retaining the static feel. In my opinion, the idea of a vip styling, such as radiused fenders to match the proportions of the insane ride height/wheels/body, aligns perfectly with the idea of static. Everything is built around one finely tuned vision, one height, one wheel gap, one bumper clearance, one perfected look with no sacrifices in its execution.

 

On the other hand, it's one thing not being able to pull into Burger King and another thing when the static life starts effecting your real life. Stuff breaks that you can't afford, you need a presentable vehicle for clients, you're wife and kids don't like when your car gets beached and they have to get out and push, etc. are all great reasons to give up the static life without any shame. I'll own bagged cars in the future when my priorities change but I will always be a static guy deep down. We don't have to judge each other for what suits our lives best. There isn't a universal "best" for everyone. But at the end of the day, the cool factor, that feeling a car gives you when you spot it rolling, and the dopamine rush that puts a huge smile on your face, static always takes it.;-]

 

Jaze Silverio
Jaze Silverio

For me, it boils down to one thing. At the very low ride heights and on the cars that I enjoy, a quality static suspension that is set up to ride low, will ride and perform better. I personally choose not to compromise my handling because there are a few speed bumps here and there. For the 3k that an air ride set up will cost you, you can have a world class set of coilovers with custom spring rates, springs from a leading spring manufacturer, custom valving, and custom lengths with air cups to get over any speed bump, obstacle or rough road. That way when i want to have a spirited drive i can have a predictable, firm ride that is designed to make my car faster and handle better, I can. And when i need to get a milk shake at any drive thru, or get in any driveway, i can do so just as easily as any bagged car and still be able to keep up with any car around any turn. 

 

On the flip side some people just don't feel the need to drive fast or have big HP. I understand that, 100%. But like i said, a well set up coilover system with the option to lift the front for an obstacle or bad road will rub less, and hit the ground less etc. than a bagged car. 

mrg7243
mrg7243

Coils and bags belong on certain cars. Would I put coils on a 65 t bird. HEELLL NO. With a car that heavy and coilovers the ride would suck. Bags would be more of the preferable option. But for most everything else it deserves coils. 

Option86
Option86

I have to say static. All my cars have been "stanced" to some extent, and they were all done with coilovers. My logic is simple, you won't catch any legitimate performance vehicle relying on air for suspension on the track... Not WRC, DTM, formula drift, or anywhere else for that matter. So, why do it to your car? Bags are just too cosmetic. If you're down for that then go nuts, it's a great look and a nice ride, but I just can't go along with it.

KelliKOatman
KelliKOatman

 @Option86 I'm sorry, but the "track vs. street" argument just does not cut it here. We are on Stanceworks! A site that praises coilovers which have been absolutely maxed out, deeming them COMPLETELY unfunctional. Basically, the only thing thats supporting your car is the fact that there's a solid metal rod (which used to be a shock) with about .5" of suspension travel. You might as well just put a 2x4 piece of wood in there, because maxed out coilovers serve zero function to a suspension. 

ollie
ollie

@Option86 No offense but your car is as static as a car rolling off the dealer lot. As a rule of thumb, if it's obvious you're on springs, labeling as static is just silly. That's just my opinion but the argument here isn't air suspension vs. traditional suspension in general. This is SW. It is a dumped, obnoxious car on coilovers versus a bagged car, both maximizing fitment and aesthetic capabilities. You're truly static in an SW sense when you can't get over speed bumps or steep driveways without getting stuck or wrecking stuff. If you're not slammed, you essentially chose a completely different route with your car, which is perfectly fine mind you, but still arguing an irrelevant point. 

Option86
Option86

 @KelliKOatman  @Option86 Actually, it cuts it pretty well. Why? Because, pretty much any coilover company worth a damn has track tested coilovers. KW, BC, Bilstein, H&R..... Megan, and so on. Street and track go hand in hand. Why would you buy ANYTHING vital, like performance suspension from a company who doesn't have track time and experience?? You must be confused, my "solid metal rods" are in fact KW threaded shock bodies, with the correct amount of travel for daily street and track days. Btw, look into spring rates and dampening, as well. I wasn't hating on bags, I support, this is just my OPINION. And S/W has featured much more than slammed or dumped rides. If you've been around longer, you might have caught that.

Jaze Silverio
Jaze Silverio

 @KelliKOatman  @Option86 That is incorrect. It is possible to have your car extremely low, without negative effects you've mentioned. Take a look at my car, I drive lower than any bagged car, and due to the design of my BWS coilovers, i do not lose suspension travel when i lower my car. I also corrected my roll center and bump steer, giving my car extremely close to stock suspension geometry. 

 

 

KelliKOatman
KelliKOatman

 @DaveSchonrock I was just saying that because Jaze was referring to what coilover setup you could buy for the same price as an air setup (which is apparently $3000) :) Yes, some air ride kits are $3000+ but I only paid about $1000 for mine.

DaveSchonrock
DaveSchonrock

 @KelliKOatman  You can get a fully custom set of coilovers for much less than $3000.  Custom spring rates using Swift springs, having the struts perfectly valved to match the rates, 2" (or more) shorter strut bodies, front camber plates and rear upper mounts (speaking specifically in your case with an E36 M).  You don't need to spend Moton money to get a great set of coilovers these days.

KelliKOatman
KelliKOatman

 @Option86 Also, don't get me wrong that bags are always better than coilovers. On a set-up like yours where you can get into driveways and parking lots and over speedbumps, you dont need a bag set-up. When your car is so ridiculously low that you cant do any of those things, then it really just becomes stupid and impractical, which is why I went with bags! Again, though, it all comes down to the scene points. If bags and coils were the same price, then I guarantee more people would be on air, but until people stop shunning and looking down upon bagriders for taking the "easy way out," there will always be die-hard centimeters-off-the-ground static fans... who really cannot justify why their suspension is so great. I have nothing against people who roll static, I know first-hand how difficult it is and how much dedication it requires. But to say that coilovers in that suspension are better than air bags is really just absurd (and I'm not talking a $3k coilover set with adjustable spring rates, dampening, and shorter shock bodies; I'm talking completely maxed out, Raceland coilovers with zero shock travel and blown shocks).

KelliKOatman
KelliKOatman

@Option86

Lol. That's cool about your "built to handle sedan," but I'm not talking about cars that are built to handle. This entire 'static vs. bags' debate was founded on the principle of staying centimeters off the ground at all times because it looks cool and carries more pride, or driving aired up and parking low because that's an intelligent thing to do. We're not debating which one is better for the track, because if we were, then I would be on the same side as you, and I would agree that coilovers are most likely better for the track than bags. The fact of the matter is, in the STANCE scene (not the race or track scene which is what you're talking about), all it really comes down to is the scene points. If you drive static, you get more scene points because you "work harder" to achieve that look, and bags get a negative rep because its the "easy way out." All I'm doing is defending bags and stating why they're not a dumb choice. I never said bags are better for every single driving situation, but I AM saying that bags are better for the driving situation which 90% of everyone else on this discussion is referring to; DAILY DRIVING. You have lost the entire point of the debate. Your side would be a great one in a discussion other than this one here, but your car isn't even low, so of course you can preach "static all day" because you've never had to go through the hardships of driving a static car that's 1 inch off the ground. And as far as I'm concerned, until you have owned cars with both suspensions, you can't honestly say which one is better. 

 

DaveT
DaveT

 @Jaze Silverio  @KelliKOatman Jaze I never actually said there was? That wasn't the point of my statement.

 

I was responding to this statement you made "Because, pretty much any coilover company worth a damn has track tested coilovers. KW, BC, Bilstein, H&R..... Megan, and so on"At least two air companies are doing these exact same tests IE https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/561187_483257708353986_1983930120_n.jpg both of these cars were raced by AirRex in the Option Cup GTand Air lift basically tracks the hell out of these two:

http://www.airliftperformance.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/DSC_4721-31-1024x682.jpghttp://www.airliftperformance.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/DSC_5624.jpg Now if you want to further refine your statement that no air company has professional race organization proven set-ups then yes it's valid. But I think at that point you are splitting hairs because I doubt that anyone with a dedicated track car is going to make the switch to air. But we are not talking dedicated track cars here now are we? 

DaveT
DaveT

 @Option86  @KelliKOatman There's been a lot of advancement in air setups lately and a lot of people are actually tracking on air. I know for a fact that Air Lift does a lot of track testing on their more recent setups.

Option86
Option86

 @KelliKOatman  @Option86 So the moral of the story is that people should avoid somebody who has a narrow understanding of stance culture (you).

Option86
Option86

 @KelliKOatman  @Option86  So you're point is that slammed cars with stretched tires, siting on the lips don't drive well with coilovers at the track. No kidding... My point, AT THE BEGINNING, was that coilovers are better for "the car" cause many are well built and track tested. You chimed in hating on people that are dumped and static, like I started this... The discussion is: "what do you prefer and why?"

 

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c375/azxdesertrat/stance007.jpg

 

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c375/azxdesertrat/stance010.jpg

 

I didn't say I was slammed, either. My sedan is built to handle. Who the f**k are you, anyways? 

KelliKOatman
KelliKOatman

 @Option86 I dont really understand how street and track go in hand; theyre completely different things. When a company designs coilovers, they arent designed to be maxed out. They arent designed for the helper springs to be removed and the perches spun all the way down like many people do with them. When theyre tested on the track, Im sure theyre at a reasonable height, not maxed out with .5" of shock travel. And if someone's car is stanced to the point where you are touching wheel to fender, that car is probably not seeing the track. I'd like to see how low your car is, because it's probably not that low if it sees both the street and track (and if you adjust the coilovers for each of those environments, then your argument is invalid). 

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